Comments on: Understanding Baptism

By: Gary Johnson

Gary Johnson — Wed, 28 Dec 2011 03:16:55 +0000

Thanks for your comments Joe. There certainly is a lot of confusion concerning baptism. Who should be baptized, when should one be baptized and what is the proper way to be baptized? Each denomination has it’s own set of rules. All this confusion happens, I believe, because churches do not separate God’s dealings with Israel and His dealings with the Body of Christ—today’s church.

When John was baptizing he did so to announce Jesus Christ to Israel. “I did not recognize Him, but so that He might be manifested to Israel, I came baptizing in water.”(John 1:31). It was a baptism of purification (John 3:22—25). When Jesus was baptized it was done to fulfill all righteousness. He did not do so for our example but to fulfill all the Law. He identified Himself with sinners as one who needed to be baptized for purification even though He was pure.

Our identificatin with Christ comes through our spiritual baptism by the Holy Spirit into Christ (1 Corinthians 12:13). There is no need to have the shadow of water baptism when we have the real thing. The idea that water baptism symbolizes our baptism into Christ’s death, burial and resurrection is not supported by Scripture. Man has take certain verses out of context then forced them to fit their idea of water baptism.

One last thought. When Jesus was on earth he came to minister to and save Israel (Matthew 1:21; 10:5). After Israel reject the offer of the Kingdom, Paul was raised up and revealed the Mystery directly from the risen Jesus Christ (Galatians 1:11, 12). When we follow the Pauline epistles we are following the last words of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ, through Paul, does not command us to be water baptized. It’s only when people try to mix together God’s dealings with Israel and His dealings with the Church that confusion reigns.

By: Paul Pedro

Paul Pedro — Tue, 27 Dec 2011 23:52:07 +0000

Joe, I appreciate your enthusiasm for this subject, but I question your interpretation. First of all, your “watery grave” picture is nowhere in Scritpure. In fact, water baptism always referred to a cleansing, not a death. Secondly, Jesus did say to repent and be baptized, but He also said to the cleansed lepers to bring their law-prescribed sacrifices to the priest after Jesus healed them? When was the last time you knew anyone who did that? Everything Jesus did and taught was under the Law and as Paul writes in 2 Corinthians 5, we no longer know Christ in the flesh. Why? Because we are not under Law, we are under grace. I ask that you prayerfully reread the article with your Bible open and set aside any preconceived notion about baptism. Again, Thanks..Paul Pedro

By: joe borg

joe borg — Tue, 27 Dec 2011 16:24:34 +0000

Is God the author of coonfusion then ? I am disgusted at how many different interpretation of our christianity we arrived at especially now in the internet age: No wonder outsiders look at us & wonder! But we are concerned at what God thinks not men. Re Baptism I understood that yes once Jesus Told to Baptise repentatnt believers – we should only ask : “who ordered Baptism”? then proceed to obey(in faith? ) how can there be both water & spirit (not to mention Fire that Jesus mentioned) and still called one? Yes: when we obey and go down into the symbolical watery grave to die & be buried with Him – He at that stage gives us His Holy Spirit as He promised : so with this one baptism we go down the symbolic watery grave & come up – resurected unto a new Spirit Filled life just as Christ told Nicodemus.
I think we should do our best and let scriptures interpret scriptures and where we are not sure – just say so
Please do not take this as critism but in brotherly love for the sake of unity

God Bless us all

Joe

By: Paul Pedro

Paul Pedro — Tue, 16 Mar 2010 00:54:16 +0000

Scott,

It seems that you have done your homework. I didn’t mention the reason for the Jewish baptisms, because that was not the subject of the article, but it was good for you to point this out. Have you ever wondered why Jesus was baptized? I submit to you, Scott, that it may be for the very reason that the Jews were baptized. One of the offices of Christ is Priest. We see this in the letter to the Hebrews in at least eight different chapters. Christ came to fulfill every part of the law and this included the ceremonial washings for the priesthood, even though He is not of the Levitical line of priests. Something to think about…

By: Scott

Scott — Mon, 08 Mar 2010 04:31:46 +0000

I wonder if there is a deeper reason for water baptism with Israel. Certainly, Jews required a sign but I think the Old Covenant sheds some light on the reason for the water baptism.

In Exodus 19:4-6, God tells Israel that He will make of them a “kingdom of priests.” As mentioned in this post above, ritual cleansings/washings were very much a part of the Law. Before the Levis could perform their priestly duties, they had to be “Levitically” cleansed. Therefore, when the repentant Jews were being baptized in water, they were being levitically washed so they could perform their kingdom priestly duties.

What else is interesting is that in the Tabernacle, there was a laver that was used for such washings. When Ezekiel describes the “millennial tabernacle” there is one piece of furniture missing: the laver! What is this significant? Well, in my judgment, water baptism was a Jewish type of regeneration. Remember that in the kingdom, God will “sprinkle” clean water on Israel (Ezekiel 36:25). Regeneration will have happened to Israel, therefore, in the millennial tabernacle you don’t see the laver, but in the OT tabernacle, you did.

By: Paul

Paul — Sun, 31 May 2009 03:55:23 +0000

Dear Rev. Deb,

Thank you for your interest in my article and the kind words that you sent. As to Paul’s comments about not baptizing many; I would agree whole heartily with you that Paul was stressing unity within the Body and that early on in his ministry he did baptize. But, as the “mystery” was more and more revealed to him, water baptism was set aside as Ephesians 4:5 clearly shows. Now, there is only ONE baptism and if it is with water, then the baptism done by the Holy Spirit in 1 Corinthians 12:13 that places every believer into the Body of Christ is null and void. Remember, Paul also “thanked God” that he hardly baptized anyone. Now, we have to ask ourselves; if water baptism was part of the commission that all believers are given, then Paul “thanked God” that he didn’t follow God’s instructions. No, Paul had a different commission than the twelve and it is this recognition that will help you understand the special message given to Paul. Read Ephesians 3:1-3 very slowly. He was given a different message that was never before revealed to anyone. With these “mysteries” came the revelation that now we are NOT to participate in the types and shadows, of which water baptism was a part of. The letter to the Hebrews is crystal clear about this. We are to be in the substance, which is Christ, and not go back to the old way. I would also challenge your assumption that water baptism represents our death and resurrection in Christ. This is found NOWHERE in the Scriptures. Every place that water baptism is mentioned it represented a washing or cleansing or purging. This again was a shadow of what Christ would do for us with His blood. Water baptism pointed to the finished work of the cross. Now that Christ has cleansed every believer, water baptism has as much part in this dispensation as do sacrifices. Everything has been completed by God in the spiritual realm.

Thank you for your interest and if you have any more questions or comments, feel free to write back. I will be taking a look at your website. I love discussing the Lord and the Scriptures, as long as they are our final authority.

In Christ,

Paul D. Pedro

By: Rev Deb

Rev Deb — Sat, 30 May 2009 15:57:43 +0000

I like your way of thinking !! Great article.. I believe as well that there are different baptisms spoken of in the word of God, but I do however, believe that water baptism is still a part of N.T. symbolic representation of our death and life in Christ. The full context of the passage you quote from in 1 Cor. 1, Paul said, that he did baptized the whole house of Stephanas, but that (i believe) his calling as an apostle was to preach the Gentiles world… Paul also stated in verse 14 that he did also baptize Crispus and Gaius and that the “others” mentioned in that verse were also baptized, just not by him… I believe the context is found in verse 10-13 “that there be no divisions among you.” That there were “cliques” developing and some were saying that they belonged to Paul, while others were saying they belonged to Apollos… Paul (I believe) said, “he was glad that he didn’t baptize “them” (vs 14) because they were the ones trying to single him out by putting him on a pedestal.

I have added you to my list of friends to follow, as I do feel you have a lot to offer.. And I love being involved with believers sites that give meaty content.. And this is one of them.. I highly respect and appreciate your hard work, as I understand the time and prayer that goes into every study.. Thank you for sharpening my iron today!!
Proverbs 27:17
Iron sharpens iron,So one man sharpens another.
Many blessings
Rev Deb
Ps please drop by and say hi and tool around a bit, Perhaps I could be so blessed as to sharpen a little iron back..